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 Post subject: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:34 am 
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Just thought I'd run this by you guys...

As we all know - I shoot the hell out of my beloved 45 cal. JHP!!
I probably have about 7,500+ rounds through it by now - and geez - it might really be closer to 10,000!!
I've kinda lost track...

I know these guns weren't really made to have multi-thousands of rounds put through them...
But, what the hell - it has a lifetime guaranty!!

We've seen in a previous post around here somewhere that the slide is wore - and wore a lot!!
But that hasn't seemed to affect - or have an effect - on how accurate it shoots.

The last time I took my spinny metal target contraption out to the range....
I had a hell of a time hitting the spinners.
It has 10 spinners on it - I put one in the chamber and a 9 round mag gives me 10 shots.
I used to be able to hit all 10 once or twice every time I went out... Not the last time!!
The most I ever got was 6 out of 10 - and that only happened once.
Most of the time I'd get 2 or 3. And too many times, I never hit any!!
10 clean misses out of 10.
A couple of times I had to shoot 8 or 9 times at one spinner to get a hit!!

Anyway - It was cleaned before I went out.
I have the infamous Mahan rear site and it's all tight and working good.
No site adjustments have been made to it recently.

I'm shooting the same brass with the same powder, with the same bullets, with the same primers,
loaded on the same press, with the same press operator,at the same target at the same distance, give or take a foot.

One thing I did do before this inaccurate thing started. Shut-up Ex....

I've always shot plated bullets - 200 grainers over the last year or so.
Mostly because I got a good deal on 5,000 of them.
Well, I'm down to the last 1,000 or so - time to get more!!

I found out about this fella that sold bullets cheaper and so I thought I'd try something different

I bought 500 230gr lead bullets from this fellow that casted them and were powder-coated.
They were very reasonably priced and they sure looked good!!

I loaded them up and shot them all. They worked fine - they weren't as accurate.
But I figgered they're hand casted and not squished out of some CNC machine somewhere - so that was expected!!
And I shot most of them in one session out at the range.

So, I go home and clean my JHP and the next time I go out with my 200gr plated bullets...
And now it shoots like crap.

So - did the cast bullets have something to do with this - or is it a coincidence??
I've cleaned the piss out of the barrel - and I can't see any lead or lead fouling in there...
I've got a bore snake and a couple of good brushes for it.

Or do you think the barrel is finally just getting wore out?
Or maybe it's the whole gun - a combination of things.
Like I said - the slide on that baby is wore!!

I thought I might take it out one more time...
And if it's still shooting like crap:
Well, I guess it's time to send her back to mom and see what they say.

But it does seem like the cast bullets must of had something to do with it.
It went to hell after I shot them up - but I dunno... :dunno:

Anyway - let see if you more experienced fellers have some advice.

Hell - this is the 1st pistol I've ever owned!!
And I've never shot any other gun I've had as much as I've shot my beloved JHP... :heart:

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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:00 pm 
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Try cleaning it a couple more times. The problem sounds awful sudden - not gradual. Maybe a bad example, but I have a Mosin rifle - I had to scrub the chamber a half dozen times or more, in a row, before my sticky bolt went away. Since I bought it, I shot 200+ rounds and never cleaned the chamber. I started getting sticky bolt, scrubbed the chamber 6 or 8 times, and now it cycles just fine. I think the HP manual advises NOT to use non-jacketed ammo. I read somewhere, that the rifling in the barrel of Hi-Point guns is shallow - this would allow faster clogging of the grooves.


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:24 pm 
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I know what it is but I was told to shut up so I can't say! ROFLOL

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"Is my HP my favorite gun? No... Is it the BEST value? Very likely. Will it work when you need it to go bang? I'd bet my life on it."
Attributed to Ex and he'll take credit for anything he can get!

"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to stand by and do nothing."
Attributed to Edmund Burke, though it's source cannot be proven.

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Sorry to see you go Dean. Never enough time and it makes
us all realize just what being mortal is. You have been a true friend to me
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 Post subject: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:43 pm 
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Just a thought here but do you have other guns that exhibit this same strange behavior?

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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:40 pm 
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dudester wrote:
Just a thought here but do you have other guns that exhibit this same strange behavior?


ROFLOL Jason, :hmmm:

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"Is my HP my favorite gun? No... Is it the BEST value? Very likely. Will it work when you need it to go bang? I'd bet my life on it."
Attributed to Ex and he'll take credit for anything he can get!

"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to stand by and do nothing."
Attributed to Edmund Burke, though it's source cannot be proven.

"Those who stand for nothing, fall for anything"
Alexander Hamilton

Sorry to see you go Dean. Never enough time and it makes
us all realize just what being mortal is. You have been a true friend to me
and I will miss you every day.



"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government
from wasting the labors of the people under the pretence of taking care of
them."

Thomas Jefferson

Not having Windows on your computer is like
not having bricks tied to your dogs collar.

http://linuxmint.com

The shin bone is a device for finding furniture in a dark room.

If the mentally deficient are not allowed to own guns then why should they be allowed to make gun laws?


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:19 pm 
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gbeecher wrote:
Try cleaning it a couple more times. The problem sounds awful sudden - not gradual. Maybe a bad example, but I have a Mosin rifle - I had to scrub the chamber a half dozen times or more, in a row, before my sticky bolt went away. Since I bought it, I shot 200+ rounds and never cleaned the chamber. I started getting sticky bolt, scrubbed the chamber 6 or 8 times, and now it cycles just fine. I think the HP manual advises NOT to use non-jacketed ammo. I read somewhere, that the rifling in the barrel of Hi-Point guns is shallow - this would allow faster clogging of the grooves.

I think I'll do just that - I'm going to clean that baby one more time.
I have a "pick" that pointy and sharp.
It's straight on one end and has a 90° bend on the other.
I think I'm gonna scratch around a bit in the grooves of the rifling and see if there's any lead in them.
Shouldn't hurt anything as long as I "stay in the grooves"...

They say that the lead can be "hard to see" sometimes.

And no doubt jacketed bullets are better - but damn - they cost a lot more!!
Always had good luck with the plated bullets.

And I do shoot the hell out of it - and it gets pretty freakin' hot!!
That probably doesn't help either - to shoot and let the barrel get hotter than hell...
Especially with lead bullets.

And after shooting the lead bullets IS when it happened. (Shut-Up Ex!!!)

I think you're right about the shallow rifling too - that's probably another factor!!

If I find some leading built up in the grooves - Then Ex can finally say....
"I TOLD YOU SO!!! :whistle:

But damn... Those lead bullets are cheap... :roll:

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Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.


“The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the state shall not be denied.”
Article VI, Section 24 of the South Dakota Constitution


I sure miss you Amp - (Dean Stephens) - Wish I could have met you.


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:21 pm 
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dudester wrote:
Just a thought here but do you have other guns that exhibit this same strange behavior?

No Sir - This is the only one...

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No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.


“The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the state shall not be denied.”
Article VI, Section 24 of the South Dakota Constitution


I sure miss you Amp - (Dean Stephens) - Wish I could have met you.


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:59 pm 
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Put one of your projectiles that shot good in the muzzle end of the barrel and see if the barrel swallows the bullet.. if so it may be the barrel worn out.. if not I would look elsewhere for the answer.

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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:41 pm 
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I've been running the Hi-Tek coated bullets in my 9's, haven't seen any decrease in accuracy when shooting the plated. Make ya an electronic bore cleaner, or I'm sure someone makes a product that supposedly gets the lead all out.

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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:21 pm 
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Sounds like the cast bullets may have been "tumbling". Need to put some on paper to check for excessive tearing around the holes. If so, send it in and have a new barrel put on it.

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 Post subject: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:40 pm 
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Glad you got the joke Ex! Lol

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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:48 pm 
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LOL. Yep and it was apropos!!!

_________________
"Is my HP my favorite gun? No... Is it the BEST value? Very likely. Will it work when you need it to go bang? I'd bet my life on it."
Attributed to Ex and he'll take credit for anything he can get!

"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to stand by and do nothing."
Attributed to Edmund Burke, though it's source cannot be proven.

"Those who stand for nothing, fall for anything"
Alexander Hamilton

Sorry to see you go Dean. Never enough time and it makes
us all realize just what being mortal is. You have been a true friend to me
and I will miss you every day.



"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government
from wasting the labors of the people under the pretence of taking care of
them."

Thomas Jefferson

Not having Windows on your computer is like
not having bricks tied to your dogs collar.

http://linuxmint.com

The shin bone is a device for finding furniture in a dark room.

If the mentally deficient are not allowed to own guns then why should they be allowed to make gun laws?


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:50 pm 
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So Dudester... did you end up getting a carbine? What's your opine?

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"Is my HP my favorite gun? No... Is it the BEST value? Very likely. Will it work when you need it to go bang? I'd bet my life on it."
Attributed to Ex and he'll take credit for anything he can get!

"All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to stand by and do nothing."
Attributed to Edmund Burke, though it's source cannot be proven.

"Those who stand for nothing, fall for anything"
Alexander Hamilton

Sorry to see you go Dean. Never enough time and it makes
us all realize just what being mortal is. You have been a true friend to me
and I will miss you every day.



"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government
from wasting the labors of the people under the pretence of taking care of
them."

Thomas Jefferson

Not having Windows on your computer is like
not having bricks tied to your dogs collar.

http://linuxmint.com

The shin bone is a device for finding furniture in a dark room.

If the mentally deficient are not allowed to own guns then why should they be allowed to make gun laws?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:04 pm 
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All I shoot in my JHP is cast bullets from the same source as you Jason. I do get some leading but I don't usually shoot more than a couple hundred in a session.

Did you adjust your charge accordingly for the new bullet?


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 Post subject: Re: JHP Is Not as Accurate as it used to be..
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2015 8:51 am 
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Makeminea4595TS wrote:
Sounds like the cast bullets may have been "tumbling". Need to put some on paper to check for excessive tearing around the holes. If so, send it in and have a new barrel put on it.
srtolly wrote:
All I shoot in my JHP is cast bullets from the same source as you Jason. I do get some leading but I don't usually shoot more than a couple hundred in a session.


Did you adjust your charge accordingly for the new bullet?


Makeminea4595TS - I think I have some paper targets I shot with the 230gr lead bullets - I look after work!!

Tolly - I used 5 grains of 700X.
It's the same charge as I use for the 200gr plated bullets

According to the on-line IMR/Hodgdon manual it's a "middle of the road" charge for the 200gr bullet.
But it's right at the max for a 230gr lead bullet.

No signs of excessive pressure - It had slightly more recoil - I shot both bullets the on the same day.
But a heavier bullet with the same charge would do that, wouldn't it??

The slide didn't blow off and cave my face in anyway... :Smile3:

I did run 10 rounds of the 200gr bullets across the chrony with that load and it showed 802fps with a SD of 23.7
A little slower than what the on-line manual shows - but they used a 5 inch barrel and my Beloved JHP has a 4.5 - I think...
So we're probably pretty "in-line" with the on-line manual.

And damn it - Ex & dudester - you guys aren't much help here!!! :D :neutral:

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Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.


“The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the state shall not be denied.”
Article VI, Section 24 of the South Dakota Constitution


I sure miss you Amp - (Dean Stephens) - Wish I could have met you.


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